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Post by tapo31 on Jul 24, 2010 21:38:23 GMT -5
And to answer your question about the negatives, I think that would still be a suitable alternative to your knee issues. During power week you are intended to use a 4 second negative anyways, so slowing it down a bit more might alleviate some of the issues in your joints. Thanks for echoing the same sentiment Dave... As a matter of fact az, it would require MORE POWER to do a slower negative. Just to be technical...it would not require more power since power refers simply to the force and speed of moving your weight in the desired direction, but it would require more effort and increased time under tension. |
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Post by downbutnotout on Jul 25, 2010 5:43:11 GMT -5
I'm sorry and not intending to offend anyone as I love you DBNO (and this is not intended for you) but........ I'm so sick of people on STEROIDS using terms like TRT and GH treatment and the like... I could head down to my doctor RIGHT NOW and get a prescription for Test and Growth but it's still STEROIDS. The pharmaceutical industry is criminal and does not care about your/my or anyones health, they care about MONEY and if they are selling STEROIDS then they are making money.. WOHOOO everyone needs TRT!!!! geez give me a break, Steroids work for everyone just like other drugs, cocaine, Extascy, Heroin, etc.. they all "WORK" to make you feel good but what are they really doing to you?  ........... Okay I'm done. Not to create an air of negativity...or get into a war...but lets hope that your wife/girlfriend never needs any estrogen therapy. Because that is just the same as a male needing testosterone. Its just that there has been boat loads of research on women needing it and very little (until recently) on men needing it. Just as an FYI...I am a lifetime drugfree competitor. After 25 years doing this my joints have taken a beating, my recovery is not what it used to be, even the sex drive has taken a little dip. So, if my values are not what they are supposed to be...do you HONESTLY expect me to sit here and "suffer"? So, with the help of an MD and blood tests I will be more than happy to have him put me on something that will put me back in the normal ranges. Will I be shooting 1000mg's of test a day..HELL NO!!! Again, what are they doing? They are being added to my body to put me back to where I am supposed to be. With all due respect, lets hope your test levels never drop. Are you aware that low levels of testosterone are linked to prostate cancer? Hmm...200mg of test a week or every other week under guidance of doctor to help out some of my issues....and prevent prostate cancer? Sign me up! I hope you arent the militant anti-drug type....it will only serve to create battles. Take it from someone who was for a good many years when I started training. I changed my tune after learning more. As I said, it took me 25 yrs to even ENTERTAIN the idea of putting something like that into my body. Eric...so, with a change in rep range on power day, would a change in rep week also been in order? For example, using 7- 9 reps on power, then 12 - 15 on rep week? Yes. If your levels are low and you are suffering, a measly 200 mgs isn't gonna do a darn thing to make you swell up and become an IFBB pro. Those guys admit to taking 3,000 mgs of AAS per week, that's not abuse, that's a death wish. And many of them have serious cardiac problems because of it. It's what gives steroids a bad name. My brother in law often does 36 hour shifts where he's placed on emergency for when they get a heart. But on his off time he loves to be active with his wonderful dog Zenda. He's been experiencing all the symptoms of low T and now feels on the mend. I agree, you guys can get pretty zealous about AAS and people using it. It's very off putting. Eric has other clients who use AAS. GASP! But as far as TRT, hearing from a brilliant surgeon that it's totally medically ok, under a doctor's care, and if you need it, same with women, a few of my mother's post menopausal friends are on TRT and they are raving. No sides, the dose is too low for that, but the benefits have helped very much. So I say, get your bloods done, discuss it with your doctor, and I hope your levels get back up there and your body can repair some of the damage done over the years. |
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Post by snowboardray on Jul 25, 2010 8:18:03 GMT -5
Thanks for echoing the same sentiment Dave... As a matter of fact az, it would require MORE POWER to do a slower negative. Just to be technical...it would not require more power since power refers simply to the force and speed of moving your weight in the desired direction, but it would require more effort and increased time under tension. True...Effort is definitely the right word. Thats what I meant.  |
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Post by All American Dave on Jul 25, 2010 15:06:02 GMT -5
Not to create an air of negativity...or get into a war...but lets hope that your wife/girlfriend never needs any estrogen therapy. Because that is just the same as a male needing testosterone. Its just that there has been boat loads of research on women needing it and very little (until recently) on men needing it. Just as an FYI...I am a lifetime drugfree competitor. After 25 years doing this my joints have taken a beating, my recovery is not what it used to be, even the sex drive has taken a little dip. So, if my values are not what they are supposed to be...do you HONESTLY expect me to sit here and "suffer"? So, with the help of an MD and blood tests I will be more than happy to have him put me on something that will put me back in the normal ranges. Will I be shooting 1000mg's of test a day..HELL NO!!! Again, what are they doing? They are being added to my body to put me back to where I am supposed to be. With all due respect, lets hope your test levels never drop. Are you aware that low levels of testosterone are linked to prostate cancer? Hmm...200mg of test a week or every other week under guidance of doctor to help out some of my issues....and prevent prostate cancer? Sign me up! I hope you arent the militant anti-drug type....it will only serve to create battles. Take it from someone who was for a good many years when I started training. I changed my tune after learning more. As I said, it took me 25 yrs to even ENTERTAIN the idea of putting something like that into my body. Eric...so, with a change in rep range on power day, would a change in rep week also been in order? For example, using 7- 9 reps on power, then 12 - 15 on rep week? Wow sorry you took that as a shot towards you?! It might be exactly what you NEED, and I'm all for it in the correct medical circumstances. My point was just that it's gotten out of hand.. I must have been a little grouchy when I wrote that because I definitely agree that there are beneficial uses of HRT and GH and I've even said that when I'm well into my 50's or when my test levels drop (and I know they will!) to a certain point that I would use it then. However to think that one can't go find a doctor to prescribe them Test and/or Growth is a little naive, or maybe it's just like that in Vegas... If you drive down the freeway and there are billboards about how great it is, then you watch TV and there are ads about how great it is, and then you read a magazine filled with ads about how great it is.. Is it any wonder that many people are starting to turn to steroids instead of hard work and discipline?! Or, again, maybe that's just in Vegas. Just hit a nerve that I had to vent. For the record: I AGREE THAT THERE ARE CASES (SUCH AS MAYBE YOURS) THAT TRT/GH/HORMONAL TREATMENT IS WARRANTED AND COULD HAVE A VERY POSITIVE EFFECT ON ONE'S QUALITY OF LIFE! |
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Post by All American Dave on Jul 25, 2010 15:20:43 GMT -5
Don't worry, you didn't offend me at all and you are my boy, but some of the points you make here are way off base. First off, if you could head to your doctor right now and get testosterone or HGH at your age then you go to a unprofessional doctor. At the very least, a good doctor would do blood tests for the level of these hormones, especially at your age. At the most, he wouldn't prescribe them at all unless your lack of these hormones resulted in a medical condition. Secondly, for you to classify the entire pharmaceutical industry as criminal is blanket prejudice. Your (and my) favorite supplement company is part of the pharmaceutical industry in case you forgot. Do pharma companies want to make money? Sure, all successful businesses in this country strive to make a profit. Also, do you appreciate that it costs over 1 billion dollars to get a drug through clinical trials to release? Do testosterone and HGH approach even a fraction of big pharma income? Nope. These drugs are manufactured for a relatively rare set of conditions and thus have a minimal market. In addition, by FDA regulations, these cannot be marketed for other conditions. Therefore, it is the doctors discretion to prescribe them for anything other than their indicated use. Finally, to compare drugs manufactured under extraordinarily strict GMP to street drugs is a stretch by anyone's definition. There are side effects to prescription meds and there are side effects to illicit street drugs, but the quality of prescription meds and their dose range are studied for years prior to release. Anyway, I understand what you are saying Swanny....you are against the use of steroids. I am right there with you, for myself it is not the right avenue, but to blame pharma companies for a problem that is largely driven by the illegal import of raw materials and production of mixtures in basement "labs" is off base at best. Well of course the SMART guy has to point out all the flaws in my argument!! lol Really though, although our Favorite supplement company All American EFX is PART of the pharmaceutical (as are you I think...) industry they for sure are not the representing force behind it. Why is it every time, and i do mean EVERY time, you watch tv there is a mass tort lawsuit against a drug company that put out a drug that says... if you died from taking this, as many people did that took it, you or the family you left behind can sue. Maybe they should start making it 2-3 billion to pass a drug through research... if it really takes a billion.... you are saying that there are 100's of BILLIONS of dollars riding on these drugs being sold...... hmmmm? ?? Maybe i'm just a conspiracy theorist at heart |
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Post by azwnbfpro on Jul 25, 2010 16:19:00 GMT -5
Not to create an air of negativity...or get into a war...but lets hope that your wife/girlfriend never needs any estrogen therapy. Because that is just the same as a male needing testosterone. Its just that there has been boat loads of research on women needing it and very little (until recently) on men needing it. Just as an FYI...I am a lifetime drugfree competitor. After 25 years doing this my joints have taken a beating, my recovery is not what it used to be, even the sex drive has taken a little dip. So, if my values are not what they are supposed to be...do you HONESTLY expect me to sit here and "suffer"? So, with the help of an MD and blood tests I will be more than happy to have him put me on something that will put me back in the normal ranges. Will I be shooting 1000mg's of test a day..HELL NO!!! Again, what are they doing? They are being added to my body to put me back to where I am supposed to be. With all due respect, lets hope your test levels never drop. Are you aware that low levels of testosterone are linked to prostate cancer? Hmm...200mg of test a week or every other week under guidance of doctor to help out some of my issues....and prevent prostate cancer? Sign me up! I hope you arent the militant anti-drug type....it will only serve to create battles. Take it from someone who was for a good many years when I started training. I changed my tune after learning more. As I said, it took me 25 yrs to even ENTERTAIN the idea of putting something like that into my body. Eric...so, with a change in rep range on power day, would a change in rep week also been in order? For example, using 7- 9 reps on power, then 12 - 15 on rep week? Wow sorry you took that as a shot towards you?! It might be exactly what you NEED, and I'm all for it in the correct medical circumstances. My point was just that it's gotten out of hand.. I must have been a little grouchy when I wrote that because I definitely agree that there are beneficial uses of HRT and GH and I've even said that when I'm well into my 50's or when my test levels drop (and I know they will!) to a certain point that I would use it then. However to think that one can't go find a doctor to prescribe them Test and/or Growth is a little naive, or maybe it's just like that in Vegas... If you drive down the freeway and there are billboards about how great it is, then you watch TV and there are ads about how great it is, and then you read a magazine filled with ads about how great it is.. Is it any wonder that many people are starting to turn to steroids instead of hard work and discipline?! Or, again, maybe that's just in Vegas. Just hit a nerve that I had to vent. For the record: I AGREE THAT THERE ARE CASES (SUCH AS MAYBE YOURS) THAT TRT/GH/HORMONAL TREATMENT IS WARRANTED AND COULD HAVE A VERY POSITIVE EFFECT ON ONE'S QUALITY OF LIFE! Actually just talked to a friend of mine in Florida....from what he said, normal values for test are 200 - 600.....his was around 30!!! I didnt necessarily take it as a shot towards me...just that your post came off as (like I described) a tad militant. If I am wrong, I sincerely apologize. Its nice to have the 'goal' of 50y/o. I actually said the same thing. Personally, I think that if someone has been training for a long time...and then add to that the ups and downs of contest dieting....their test production is going to take a bigger hit than someone who is the casual lifter. I could be very off base here...but I that is just a theory of mine. As far as finding a doctor that will do it no matter what...well, I am not sure its that easy. I am sure they want to cover their asses more so with test due to the repercussions some of the doctors that have given athletes drugs have received. Again, total speculation on my part. |
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Post by downbutnotout on Jul 25, 2010 17:35:11 GMT -5
Don't worry, you didn't offend me at all and you are my boy, but some of the points you make here are way off base. First off, if you could head to your doctor right now and get testosterone or HGH at your age then you go to a unprofessional doctor. At the very least, a good doctor would do blood tests for the level of these hormones, especially at your age. At the most, he wouldn't prescribe them at all unless your lack of these hormones resulted in a medical condition. Secondly, for you to classify the entire pharmaceutical industry as criminal is blanket prejudice. Your (and my) favorite supplement company is part of the pharmaceutical industry in case you forgot. Do pharma companies want to make money? Sure, all successful businesses in this country strive to make a profit. Also, do you appreciate that it costs over 1 billion dollars to get a drug through clinical trials to release? Do testosterone and HGH approach even a fraction of big pharma income? Nope. These drugs are manufactured for a relatively rare set of conditions and thus have a minimal market. In addition, by FDA regulations, these cannot be marketed for other conditions. Therefore, it is the doctors discretion to prescribe them for anything other than their indicated use. Finally, to compare drugs manufactured under extraordinarily strict GMP to street drugs is a stretch by anyone's definition. There are side effects to prescription meds and there are side effects to illicit street drugs, but the quality of prescription meds and their dose range are studied for years prior to release. Anyway, I understand what you are saying Swanny....you are against the use of steroids. I am right there with you, for myself it is not the right avenue, but to blame pharma companies for a problem that is largely driven by the illegal import of raw materials and production of mixtures in basement "labs" is off base at best. Well of course the SMART guy has to point out all the flaws in my argument!! lol Really though, although our Favorite supplement company All American EFX is PART of the pharmaceutical (as are you I think...) industry they for sure are not the representing force behind it. Why is it every time, and i do mean EVERY time, you watch tv there is a mass tort lawsuit against a drug company that put out a drug that says... if you died from taking this, as many people did that took it, you or the family you left behind can sue. Maybe they should start making it 2-3 billion to pass a drug through research... if it really takes a billion.... you are saying that there are 100's of BILLIONS of dollars riding on these drugs being sold...... hmmmm? ?? Maybe i'm just a conspiracy theorist at heart My best friend dropped dead of a mixture of Wellbutrin and the smoking patch. Utterly unheard of in medicine, his case had them baffled. ANY drug can do ANYTHING to you, no matter how common it's prescribed. All drugs have sides, some people just respond differently. And while there are doctors screaming to be sued for malpractice by prescribing things they shouldn't, MOST doctors would deny a healthy person TRT or GH flat out if asked. Your blood tells a story. The doctor looks at that story and decides from that point. It's for sure bigger cities tend to have more drug "plugs", especially Vegas and LA. Seems that's where the "dirtier" doctors migrate. Doesn't surprise me you see more commercial space given to drugs in that area. I lived out there too. Where I am now, my doctors are so conservative it's frustrating! Man, I give blood like I'm a vampire's ho! Then they oooooh and ahhh over how perfect my lipids are like it's Christmas morning. I'm one of those people who's bionic to sides. I get zero for the most part. |
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Post by downbutnotout on Jul 25, 2010 17:48:45 GMT -5
Just got a text from Meshy boy my bro in law the surgeon. He just got finished putting a HEART inside a man's chest and got it to pump and it's saved his life. God, can you imagine? Matthew says every time he opens up someone he gets the sense of God most strongly, not in Church, not with other believers. When he's looking at how we're made. Fearfully and wonderfully.
Anyhoo I asked about his TRT and how natty bbers can be a bit, as was said, militant. He chuckled. He says do your research and see your doctor, if it's a GOOD doctor, and discuss what TRT really is, that we shouldn't even ARGUE about it because it's so minimal yet so beneficial. He knows body builders are taking thousands of milligrams. He's seen a couple enlarged hearts in abusing body builders throughout his career. He says TRT comes no where NEAR what they're doing. To compare the two is like comparing a semi truck to a Playskool tricycle for a 2 year old. And Mesh is one of the most conservative doctors I know.
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Post by All American Dave on Jul 25, 2010 18:30:34 GMT -5
I like threads like this... sorry for coming off so militant, not really how I am... except when I'm trying to prove a point Good discussion ya'll I will back off my original post and use the excuse that I've seen numerous acquaintances recently decide to try and get ripped but they've never worked out, drink all the time, eat terribly and have delusions that steroids (two guys I know were prescribed it from the doctor, 29-33 years old) are all you need, and that's what has me so quick to vent but this was not the correct way. Peace and Love God Bless! |
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Post by downbutnotout on Jul 26, 2010 5:40:53 GMT -5
I like threads like this... sorry for coming off so militant, not really how I am... except when I'm trying to prove a point Good discussion ya'll I will back off my original post and use the excuse that I've seen numerous acquaintances recently decide to try and get ripped but they've never worked out, drink all the time, eat terribly and have delusions that steroids (two guys I know were prescribed it from the doctor, 29-33 years old) are all you need, and that's what has me so quick to vent but this was not the correct way. Peace and Love God Bless! Oh wow yeah that would totally piss ME off! Losers who aren't busting EXTREME ass in the gym for at least 5 years natty, or more even, and eating junk and sitting on the asses and getting gear from an obviously irresponsible doctor is SO wrong! But don't let a couple of losers color your view of steroids' full spectrum and doctors who are GOOD. Your losers aren't the norm, thank God, they just happen to know you and got under your skin. They would me too. I'd totally throw a 45 lb plate at their head! But just know, typically guys like that aren't the case. But you're a dear for being so peaceful and caring in this post. God bless you too! And tell those a-holes they're morons! |
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Post by azwnbfpro on Jul 26, 2010 21:52:53 GMT -5
Well...then this will TOTALLY get you going.....I have been researching HRT in my office. My rehab therapist is a 27y/o guy who lifts...does not bodybuild..plays golf...does like to drink every now and then. Recently we had him diet to go to Vegas (per his request when he realized he wasnt very lean at 6'2" and 247). Well, after Vegas he was not quick to get back to gym and now hears what some of the benefits are of taking some of the 'stuff' and wants to get on some too. I am like "you havent even gotten back to the gym fully and back on a good eating plan for crying out loud". I also say...I have about 12 - 15 years more of lifting on you and I have taken more of a beating than you have. You shouldnt even be worrying about this stuff at this point. I WISH I still had your levels!!!
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Post by downbutnotout on Jul 27, 2010 5:42:32 GMT -5
Well...then this will TOTALLY get you going.....I have been researching HRT in my office. My rehab therapist is a 27y/o guy who lifts...does not bodybuild..plays golf...does like to drink every now and then. Recently we had him diet to go to Vegas (per his request when he realized he wasnt very lean at 6'2" and 247). Well, after Vegas he was not quick to get back to gym and now hears what some of the benefits are of taking some of the 'stuff' and wants to get on some too. I am like "you havent even gotten back to the gym fully and back on a good eating plan for crying out loud". I also say...I have about 12 - 15 years more of lifting on you and I have taken more of a beating than you have. You shouldnt even be worrying about this stuff at this point. I WISH I still had your levels!!! Ohhhh man you're right THAT pisses me OFF. GOD I hate how steroids are given a bad name by morons in the gym who tell other morons like this 27 year old guy to get "on gear". ARGH! He SHOULD be busting his ass for YEARS to achieve genetic potential, at 27, unless he's ill, he's got major test levels that are awesome for gaining muscle. What a dill hole! 5 minutes with me I'd smack some sense into them. I've known plenty of guys who also start AAS when they're fat or even close to obese thinking test will rip them up. Um no, diet and cardio does that. Test or any other AAS is SOOOOOOO not a miracle in a bottle that does it all for you. YOU do it for you, by sweating and bleeding your butt off! Consider him SMACKED! LOL |
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........... Okay I'm done.
